A great article on Heel Roman Reigns

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NWK2000
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A great article on Heel Roman Reigns

Post by NWK2000 » Aug 31st, '20, 14:21

I was going to post a 2 Cents of why I'm genuinely pumped for Heel Roman Reigns, but this guy sums it up better than I ever could.
https://www.bodyslam.net/2020/08/31/i-h ... C2AXA3QQ78

Roman basically being a kayfabe version of what Brock Lesnar was IRL is going to be a good touch.
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Re: A great article on Heel Roman Reigns

Post by cero2k » Aug 31st, '20, 15:34

my only questions is why they went with the heel turn now when WWE finally has control over how the fans are told to react on the live shows
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Re: A great article on Heel Roman Reigns

Post by Big Red Machine » Aug 31st, '20, 16:34

NWK2000 wrote: Aug 31st, '20, 14:21 I was going to post a 2 Cents of why I'm genuinely pumped for Heel Roman Reigns, but this guy sums it up better than I ever could.
https://www.bodyslam.net/2020/08/31/i-h ... C2AXA3QQ78

Roman basically being a kayfabe version of what Brock Lesnar was IRL is going to be a good touch.
I'm going to disagree with this. The issue with "the bell already rang, he missed his chance," is key, because the problem there really isn't Roman; it's WWE's lack of internal logic and enforcement. Roman hadn't signed the contract yet and thus wasn't officially "in the match," and yet it was still introduced as a three-way, so he was. The right way to do this would have been to have it be a singles match because Roman didn't sign the contract; then have him come out and sign the contract. Vince/Pearce/whoever (not someone like Hunter or Shane who would have to get back up) would come out and tell him "no, it's too late," and he would punch that person out. The referee wouldn't count his pins so he'd beat up the referee, Heyman would put on the shirt and make the count, and they'd leave, stealing the belt.

Also, the "he waited like a coward" thing is right... but at the same time, he was taking a calculated risk. Any one of those nearfalls could have theoretically been the finish, and Roman would have been sh*t out of luck because he was sitting in the back, waiting. I don't want to say it's hard to be angry at him, but I do think that it's important to acknowledge that his strategy was not without serious risk.




And as for the overall idea, the flaw in "Roman being a kayfabe version of what Brock was IRL" is as follows: What Brock was IRL was also what Brock was in kayfabe, and people were sick and tired of it. I don't think fans are going to stand for an absentee champion, and using Roman as one will get the wrong kind of heat, just like doing it with Brock was getting the wrong kind of heat.

I think the way to take this heel Roman is to make him a combination of what Kevin Owens was supposed to be in NXT, and also just a mean person. He wants to fight to make money, but he's not going to be fighting just to please the stupid fans who hated him just because he wasn't some indy darling who did flips and worked in Japan. He won't fight all the time, but if the promotion makes it worth his while, he's not going to avoid fighting.
Also, he should just be ill-tempered. My favorite thing he did at the PPV was when he yelled "GET YOUR ASS OUT HERE!" at the second referee. Stuff like that. I'm not saying to go as far as having him call Charly Caruso a whore out of the blue, but just make him someone that you don't see why anyone could possibly want to be friends with. Someone that everyone would want to spend as little time around as possible because he's just so miserable to be around. As a general rule, he should respond to everyone other than Heyman in the rudest way possible while still being just barely socially acceptable, and even Heyman he should be gruff with and merely tolerant of.
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Re: A great article on Heel Roman Reigns

Post by NWK2000 » Aug 31st, '20, 16:42

cero2k wrote: Aug 31st, '20, 15:34 my only questions is why they went with the heel turn now when WWE finally has control over how the fans are told to react on the live shows
To put on my fantasy booking thinking cap, I really hope they sell it like, "I stayed home because of COVID, because I wanted to be around for my kids, and what was the edict that came down? "Don't mention Roman on TV," I tried to be the flagbearer and this is how I get treated? Fuck you, I'mma do what I want now"
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Re: A great article on Heel Roman Reigns

Post by NWK2000 » Aug 31st, '20, 16:47

Big Red Machine wrote: Aug 31st, '20, 16:34
NWK2000 wrote: Aug 31st, '20, 14:21 I was going to post a 2 Cents of why I'm genuinely pumped for Heel Roman Reigns, but this guy sums it up better than I ever could.
https://www.bodyslam.net/2020/08/31/i-h ... C2AXA3QQ78

Roman basically being a kayfabe version of what Brock Lesnar was IRL is going to be a good touch.
I'm going to disagree with this. The issue with "the bell already rang, he missed his chance," is key, because the problem there really isn't Roman; it's WWE's lack of internal logic and enforcement. Roman hadn't signed the contract yet and thus wasn't officially "in the match," and yet it was still introduced as a three-way, so he was. The right way to do this would have been to have it be a singles match because Roman didn't sign the contract; then have him come out and sign the contract. Vince/Pearce/whoever (not someone like Hunter or Shane who would have to get back up) would come out and tell him "no, it's too late," and he would punch that person out. The referee wouldn't count his pins so he'd beat up the referee, Heyman would put on the shirt and make the count, and they'd leave, stealing the belt.
I imagine in kayfabe, Heyman is such an expert politicer backstage in kayfabe that he can twist Roman stealing the belt as something that, is beneficial for both the company (keeping a pissed off, shafted Roman Reigns happy, see above) and beneficial to Roman honestly

I think the way to take this heel Roman is to make him a combination of what Kevin Owens was supposed to be in NXT, and also just a mean person. He wants to fight to make money, but he's not going to be fighting just to please the stupid fans who hated him just because he wasn't some indy darling who did flips and worked in Japan. He won't fight all the time, but if the promotion makes it worth his while, he's not going to avoid fighting.
Also, he should just be ill-tempered. My favorite thing he did at the PPV was when he yelled "GET YOUR ASS OUT HERE!" at the second referee. Stuff like that. I'm not saying to go as far as having him call Charly Caruso a whore out of the blue, but just make him someone that you don't see why anyone could possibly want to be friends with. Someone that everyone would want to spend as little time around as possible because he's just so miserable to be around. As a general rule, he should respond to everyone other than Heyman in the rudest way possible while still being just barely socially acceptable, and even Heyman he should be gruff with and merely tolerant of.
That can also work too. He won't be absentee like Brock was, but I feel like Roman will be portrayed as a rung above the rest of the locker room because he's managed by Heyman, extra contract finagler.
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Re: A great article on Heel Roman Reigns

Post by Big Red Machine » Aug 31st, '20, 16:59

NWK2000 wrote: Aug 31st, '20, 16:47
Big Red Machine wrote: Aug 31st, '20, 16:34
NWK2000 wrote: Aug 31st, '20, 14:21 I was going to post a 2 Cents of why I'm genuinely pumped for Heel Roman Reigns, but this guy sums it up better than I ever could.
https://www.bodyslam.net/2020/08/31/i-h ... C2AXA3QQ78

Roman basically being a kayfabe version of what Brock Lesnar was IRL is going to be a good touch.
I'm going to disagree with this. The issue with "the bell already rang, he missed his chance," is key, because the problem there really isn't Roman; it's WWE's lack of internal logic and enforcement. Roman hadn't signed the contract yet and thus wasn't officially "in the match," and yet it was still introduced as a three-way, so he was. The right way to do this would have been to have it be a singles match because Roman didn't sign the contract; then have him come out and sign the contract. Vince/Pearce/whoever (not someone like Hunter or Shane who would have to get back up) would come out and tell him "no, it's too late," and he would punch that person out. The referee wouldn't count his pins so he'd beat up the referee, Heyman would put on the shirt and make the count, and they'd leave, stealing the belt.
I imagine in kayfabe, Heyman is such an expert politicer backstage in kayfabe that he can twist Roman stealing the belt as something that, is beneficial for both the company (keeping a pissed off, shafted Roman Reigns happy, see above) and beneficial to Roman honestly
That doesn't solve the problem I described, though. Any idea that Roman is, in kayfabe, what Brock was, is ruined by the fact that Roman was not supposed to be officially in the match because he hadn't signed the contract, and it it was announced at the beginning that he was. It's a contract for the match, and they spent all of Smackdown telling us that it needed to be signed or else there couldn't be a three-way. It makes the company complicity in Roman's kayfabe BS, which was also the problem with Brock at MITB.
NWK2000 wrote: Aug 31st, '20, 16:47
I think the way to take this heel Roman is to make him a combination of what Kevin Owens was supposed to be in NXT, and also just a mean person. He wants to fight to make money, but he's not going to be fighting just to please the stupid fans who hated him just because he wasn't some indy darling who did flips and worked in Japan. He won't fight all the time, but if the promotion makes it worth his while, he's not going to avoid fighting.
Also, he should just be ill-tempered. My favorite thing he did at the PPV was when he yelled "GET YOUR ASS OUT HERE!" at the second referee. Stuff like that. I'm not saying to go as far as having him call Charly Caruso a whore out of the blue, but just make him someone that you don't see why anyone could possibly want to be friends with. Someone that everyone would want to spend as little time around as possible because he's just so miserable to be around. As a general rule, he should respond to everyone other than Heyman in the rudest way possible while still being just barely socially acceptable, and even Heyman he should be gruff with and merely tolerant of.
That can also work too. He won't be absentee like Brock was, but I feel like Roman will be portrayed as a rung above the rest of the locker room because he's managed by Heyman, extra contract finagler.
Yes... but this wasn't the issue with Brock. The issue with Brock was "he hates to be here and doesn't love being a WWE Superstar(tm). That can happen with or without this Heyman turn, and I think people are sick of that as a reason to boo someone, just like they're tired of being asked to care about who is being a "locker room leader."
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Re: A great article on Heel Roman Reigns

Post by NWK2000 » Aug 31st, '20, 19:46

Big Red Machine wrote: Aug 31st, '20, 16:59 Yes... but this wasn't the issue with Brock. The issue with Brock was "he hates to be here and doesn't love being a WWE Superstar(tm). That can happen with or without this Heyman turn, and I think people are sick of that as a reason to boo someone, just like they're tired of being asked to care about who is being a "locker room leader."
There are several incredibly plausible reasons to justify that. He got wiped from TV for staying home and protecting himself from COVID as a medical risk. For prolonging his time on Earth with his children, he was cast aside. Hell, if you didn't want to get heavy with it, you could just have him be peeved at being denied his Mania match with Goldberg, so fuck that lockeroom leader crap.
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Re: A great article on Heel Roman Reigns

Post by Big Red Machine » Aug 31st, '20, 22:45

NWK2000 wrote: Aug 31st, '20, 19:46
Big Red Machine wrote: Aug 31st, '20, 16:59 Yes... but this wasn't the issue with Brock. The issue with Brock was "he hates to be here and doesn't love being a WWE Superstar(tm). That can happen with or without this Heyman turn, and I think people are sick of that as a reason to boo someone, just like they're tired of being asked to care about who is being a "locker room leader."
There are several incredibly plausible reasons to justify that. He got wiped from TV for staying home and protecting himself from COVID as a medical risk. For prolonging his time on Earth with his children, he was cast aside. Hell, if you didn't want to get heavy with it, you could just have him be peeved at being denied his Mania match with Goldberg, so fuck that lockeroom leader crap.
But if you go in those directions, it's not the Brock thing, which was the premise your were promoting.
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