Day-to-Day Quote Topic

[cero2k]

I didn't even know Cary and Riccaboni had a podcast.

[Big Red Machine]

I knew Cary had one but didn't realize Ian was the involved.

[cero2k]

Impact is the only promotion that is really taking advantage of this 'forbidden door' schtick.

They've had Omega, Matt Hardy, Private Party, Tony Khan, FinJuice, ELP, and now Kojima.

[Big Red Machine]

Impact is the only promotion that is really taking advantage of this 'forbidden door' schtick.

They've had Omega, Matt Hardy, Private Party, Tony Khan, FinJuice, ELP, and now Kojima.

Not to be "that guy," but has this actually worked? Other than Omega a few times, have these guest appearances actually boosted anyone's ratings? We know that Guns & Gallows hasn't meant anything for AEW, and I don't think Nagata did either. I think that "interpromotional" stuff has been done to death to the point where it doesn't draw on it's own, just like invasions. It's the match-up that matters now. The interpromotional nature of it is just a reason for why it feels fresh and exciting rather than inherently adding something on its own. You either need the right match-up or, like with an invasion, heat between the companies has to be believable.

[cero2k]

Not to be "that guy," but has this actually worked? Other than Omega a few times, have these guest appearances actually boosted anyone's ratings? We know that Guns & Gallows hasn't meant anything for AEW, and I don't think Nagata did either. I think that "interpromotional" stuff has been done to death to the point where it doesn't draw on it's own, just like invasions. It's the match-up that matters now. The interpromotional nature of it is just a reason for why it feels fresh and exciting rather than inherently adding something on its own. You either need the right match-up or, like with an invasion, heat between the companies has to be believable.

It works for my impact entertainment, don't really care about the rest. But I kinda disagree, the last thing I want is a feud between promotions. I like the occasional tour/feud and that's it, quick rotations, no one overstays their welcome, the booking of the whole promotion doesn't become about one thing.

[Big Red Machine]

Not to be "that guy," but has this actually worked? Other than Omega a few times, have these guest appearances actually boosted anyone's ratings? We know that Guns & Gallows hasn't meant anything for AEW, and I don't think Nagata did either. I think that "interpromotional" stuff has been done to death to the point where it doesn't draw on it's own, just like invasions. It's the match-up that matters now. The interpromotional nature of it is just a reason for why it feels fresh and exciting rather than inherently adding something on its own. You either need the right match-up or, like with an invasion, heat between the companies has to be believable.

It works for my impact entertainment, don't really care about the rest. But I kinda disagree, the last thing I want is a feud between promotions. I like the occasional tour/feud and that's it, quick rotations, no one overstays their welcome, the booking of the whole promotion doesn't become about one thing.

I don't want to see an interpromotional feud, either. But what I'm saying is that if your goal is to boost ratings, I think that's the only way it will work. If your goal is just to have it be kind of cool that someone you don't normally see in the US is on your show (the way AEW did with Nagata or the way ROH used Ultimo Guerrero in the spots they used him in) then it's fine, but don't expect a ratings boost. I assume this is what TNA has in mind with Kojima. The FinnJuice thing, though, I just don't see a point to. All it felt like was cheapening switch and switch back of the tag titles.

[cero2k]

I don't want to see an interpromotional feud, either. But what I'm saying is that if your goal is to boost ratings, I think that's the only way it will work. If your goal is just to have it be kind of cool that someone you don't normally see in the US is on your show (the way AEW did with Nagata or the way ROH used Ultimo Guerrero in the spots they used him in) then it's fine, but don't expect a ratings boost. I assume this is what TNA has in mind with Kojima. The FinnJuice thing, though, I just don't see a point to. All it felt like was cheapening switch and switch back of the tag titles.

I think each promotion has their own reasons for this. Impact in particular feels more like they want to become a hub for watching established talent from all over the place. Everyone wants ratings, but I don't see Impact thinking that Kojima or ELP are ratings quick schemes, but a long term rise with the idea that if you watch Impact, people from all over the world come to wrestle here.

Whereas AEW and NJPW feel more like they just want places to send their guys and make it seem they're the ones all over the place. Each approach has a purpose that is appropriate for the size of the promotion.

As for FinJuice, I thought the change was quite positive. I feel that Impact wanted to get the titles off the Good Brothers if they were going to become lackeys to Omega, in both AEW and Impact, they've been portrayed as henchmen more than anything, and I think Impact wanted the titles on a stronger team and one that wasn't going to be taking a lot of pins for the sake of allowing Swann/Edwards/Moose/Callihan/Mox/etc get wins over Omega in tag matches; moreover, with Ethan Page gone and Shelley unable to wrestle, FinJuice was a good choice while they built other teams. They spent the last two months getting the titles featured on NJPW shows, with FinJuice cutting promos about watching Impact, and the NJPW commentary talking about the titles, meanwhile on Impact, they've been rebuilding the tag division a bit. Coming off a North 380 day reign, and a Good Brothers 120 day reign, a short 20 day reign is not that bad.

If they were into quick title changes for the sake of making news, ELP would had won the X title last saturday, instead Josh Alexander got a straight clean win over him. Given how unstable the Impact roster is sometimes, the titles have been well managed for the last 2 or so years.

[Big Red Machine]

I don't want to see an interpromotional feud, either. But what I'm saying is that if your goal is to boost ratings, I think that's the only way it will work. If your goal is just to have it be kind of cool that someone you don't normally see in the US is on your show (the way AEW did with Nagata or the way ROH used Ultimo Guerrero in the spots they used him in) then it's fine, but don't expect a ratings boost. I assume this is what TNA has in mind with Kojima. The FinnJuice thing, though, I just don't see a point to. All it felt like was cheapening switch and switch back of the tag titles.

I think each promotion has their own reasons for this. Impact in particular feels more like they want to become a hub for watching established talent from all over the place. Everyone wants ratings, but I don't see Impact thinking that Kojima or ELP are ratings quick schemes, but a long term rise with the idea that if you watch Impact, people from all over the world come to wrestle here.

Whereas AEW and NJPW feel more like they just want places to send their guys and make it seem they're the ones all over the place. Each approach has a purpose that is appropriate for the size of the promotion.

As for FinJuice, I thought the change was quite positive. I feel that Impact wanted to get the titles off the Good Brothers if they were going to become lackeys to Omega, in both AEW and Impact, they've been portrayed as henchmen more than anything, and I think Impact wanted the titles on a stronger team and one that wasn't going to be taking a lot of pins for the sake of allowing Swann/Edwards/Moose/Callihan/Mox/etc get wins over Omega in tag matches; moreover, with Ethan Page gone and Shelley unable to wrestle, FinJuice was a good choice while they built other teams. They spent the last two months getting the titles featured on NJPW shows, with FinJuice cutting promos about watching Impact, and the NJPW commentary talking about the titles, meanwhile on Impact, they've been rebuilding the tag division a bit. Coming off a North 380 day reign, and a Good Brothers 120 day reign, a short 20 day reign is not that bad.

If they were into quick title changes for the sake of making news, ELP would had won the X title last saturday, instead Josh Alexander got a straight clean win over him. Given how unstable the Impact roster is sometimes, the titles have been well managed for the last 2 or so years.

I agree with what you're saying in theory. I just don't think FinnJuice are that strong a team. I think it would have been better to set up a TNA team to put the belts on.

[cero2k]

I agree with what you're saying in theory. I just don't think FinnJuice are that strong a team. I think it would have been better to set up a TNA team to put the belts on.

But that's what I was saying, out of kinda nowhere, they lost three big teams in MCMG, The North, and The Rascalz. The only teams left were combos like XXXL, TJP/Fallah Bahh, or the weird combo of James Storm and Chris Sabin. Given the circumstances and the need for a transitional champion, FinJuice was ok and available to do a couple of tapings. Now that they put effort in building Violent By Design a bit, they've taken the titles.

I can't think of many bigger teams they would had been able to get from either AEW or NJPW

[Big Red Machine]

I agree with what you're saying in theory. I just don't think FinnJuice are that strong a team. I think it would have been better to set up a TNA team to put the belts on.

But that's what I was saying, out of kinda nowhere, they lost three big teams in MCMG, The North, and The Rascalz. The only teams left were combos like XXXL, TJP/Fallah Bahh, or the weird combo of James Storm and Chris Sabin. Given the circumstances and the need for a transitional champion, FinJuice was ok and available to do a couple of tapings. Now that they put effort in building Violent By Design a bit, they've taken the titles.

I can't think of many bigger teams they would had been able to get from either AEW or NJPW

I think the Storm/Sabin combo would have worked perfectly well for TNA's needs, and I don't think you needed a "transitional champion" (or at least not in the usual sense of a short title reign). I think they should have either put the belts right on Violent By Design and built them up as champions and as the new thing in the division, or put the belts on Storm/Sabin and kept them there for a while while building Violent By Design up to the point them winning the belts feels like it has to happen and then you do the switch.

[cero2k]

I think the Storm/Sabin combo would have worked perfectly well for TNA's needs, and I don't think you needed a "transitional champion" (or at least not in the usual sense of a short title reign). I think they should have either put the belts right on Violent By Design and built them up as champions and as the new thing in the division, or put the belts on Storm/Sabin and kept them there for a while while building Violent By Design up to the point them winning the belts feels like it has to happen and then you do the switch.

Trust me from someone what watches every single show Impact has. FinJuice was a better option that those two teams, two months ago.

What's your problem with FinJuice?

[Big Red Machine]

I think the Storm/Sabin combo would have worked perfectly well for TNA's needs, and I don't think you needed a "transitional champion" (or at least not in the usual sense of a short title reign). I think they should have either put the belts right on Violent By Design and built them up as champions and as the new thing in the division, or put the belts on Storm/Sabin and kept them there for a while while building Violent By Design up to the point them winning the belts feels like it has to happen and then you do the switch.

Trust me from someone what watches every single show Impact has. FinJuice was a better option that those two teams, two months ago.

What's your problem with FinJuice?

They come across as very blah. I know they're capable wrestlers, but the pairing (and really Finlay in general) just doesn't interest me. Maybe the issue that I've pretty much only seen them in New Japan, where most people feel either bland or cartoonishly over the top with very little middle ground I imagine they're being allowed to show more range and getting fleshed out a bit on Impact, but the idea that "FinJuice are coming in!" isn't the sort of thing that would make me say "hey, maybe I should watch TNA this week."

[cero2k]

They come across as very blah. I know they're capable wrestlers, but the pairing (and really Finlay in general) just doesn't interest me. Maybe the issue that I've pretty much only seen them in New Japan, where most people feel either bland or cartoonishly over the top with very little middle ground I imagine they're being allowed to show more range and getting fleshed out a bit on Impact, but the idea that "FinJuice are coming in!" isn't the sort of thing that would make me say "hey, maybe I should watch TNA this week."

I can agree with some of that, in NJPW i too find them meh, I'll take a random pair up of CHAOS dudes over them, but I do find Finlay way more enjoyable than Juice, I dreaded Juice matches last G1. I do think they come off as slightly bigger deals on Impact, though they come in as an established team, and while you're seeing it as "FinJuice is coming to Impact", the idea and thought in people's heads is "NJPW wrestlers are coming to Impact"

FinJuice is a team that you really need to watch the promos in order to see them more than just wacky cartoon guys. I've struggled with that myself.

[Big Red Machine]

while you're seeing it as "FinJuice is coming to Impact", the idea and thought in people's heads is "NJPW wrestlers are coming

Maybe I've just become jaded because of the way the ROH/NJPW deal played out, but, to me, one set of NJPW guys does not imply another. If New Japan feels like sending the big guns, they'll send the big guns, but I have no faith that they will. They even stopped sending them to ROH relatively quickly. They'll send TNA FinJuice and the Tongans and O-Kharn. They're not sending Okada or Naito or Tanahashi or Ibushi or Jay White or Ospreay or Shingo to TNA. If they send those guys anywhere, it's going to be ROH or AEW (and unnecessarily ruffling feathers with ROH and/or AEW is exactly why they won't).

[cero2k]

Maybe I've just become jaded because of the way the ROH/NJPW deal played out, but, to me, one set of NJPW guys does not imply another. If New Japan feels like sending the big guns, they'll send the big guns, but I have no faith that they will. They even stopped sending them to ROH relatively quickly. They'll send TNA FinJuice and the Tongans and O-Kharn. They're not sending Okada or Naito or Tanahashi or Ibushi or Jay White or Ospreay or Shingo to TNA. If they send those guys anywhere, it's going to be ROH or AEW (and unnecessarily ruffling feathers with ROH and/or AEW is exactly why they won't).

I may be in the most minority of minorities, but I don't want any top NJPW guy on Impact or AEW or ROH to begin with. I am a bigger fan of NJPW than most promotions, and from that standpoint, I don't want my top guys going for programs to the US or the UK or Mexico. I'm happy with the NJPW midcard going around the place, but the true top guys, I just want to see them in NJPW with NJPW standards and have them feel untouchable. Even those Giant Baba shows feel weird sometimes.

I've mention it before, what I want from this whole 'forbidden door' thing is talent exchange for the sake of getting experience, I want the Naritas and the Uemuras and the Fredericks to get experience on DARK, I want Chris Bey and Jungle Boy to do tours in Japan for the BOSJs, I want AEW to rotate talent and send people to Impact/NWA/AAA while they take a break from AEW television. The whole dream match gets overplayed and overused so much that realistically, there's barely any real real dream match to begin with.

[Big Red Machine]

Rey on Dominik possibly wearing the mask:

“That was the idea from day one when he started training,” Rey said. “I said Dom will continue with this legacy and carry it on. We never really had the opportunity to sit down and discuss our plans which now in retrospect we can look at it and say it’s still not late to make things happen like we had it planned out. I think Dom is going to have to earn the mask now. He’s on his way, eventually one day, maybe the mask will be on.”

[NWK2000]

I may be in the most minority of minorities, but I don't want any top NJPW guy on Impact or AEW or ROH to begin with. I am a bigger fan of NJPW than most promotions, and from that standpoint, I don't want my top guys going for programs to the US or the UK or Mexico. I'm happy with the NJPW midcard going around the place, but the true top guys, I just want to see them in NJPW with NJPW standards and have them feel untouchable. Even those Giant Baba shows feel weird sometimes.

You are, and I think why you are is because the one big US G1 show they did practically happened in your backyard. Me? I just wanna see Okada at a show I can see live without having to leave the US.

[cero2k]

You are, and I think why you are is because the one big US G1 show they did practically happened in your backyard. Me? I just wanna see Okada at a show I can see live without having to leave the US.

Let me be more precise, I'm perfectly ok with NJPW coming to the US, doing a NJPW show like Dallas. It's seeing Okada/Tana/Ibushi in an AEW storyline that I don't really want.

[Big Red Machine]

I may be in the most minority of minorities, but I don't want any top NJPW guy on Impact or AEW or ROH to begin with. I am a bigger fan of NJPW than most promotions, and from that standpoint, I don't want my top guys going for programs to the US or the UK or Mexico. I'm happy with the NJPW midcard going around the place, but the true top guys, I just want to see them in NJPW with NJPW standards and have them feel untouchable. Even those Giant Baba shows feel weird sometimes.

You are, and I think why you are is because the one big US G1 show they did practically happened in your backyard. Me? I just wanna see Okada at a show I can see live without having to leave the US.

I'm with Cero, but for different reasons. I don't want to see them in other promotions because Gedo won't let them lose, and the bookers of the other promotions have not proven themselves adept at finding someone can benefit from a competitive loss to NJPW's top stars and using that moment well.

Also... let's be honest here. Most of these guys are not Liger. If you put them on a non-NJPW show in the US, they just coast. Ibushi, Ospreay, Zack, and Hiromu won't, but I don't trust anyone else. Maybe White and KENTA, too. At this point, I'd much rather have Kojima, Makabe, or (especially) Nagata than Tanahashi or Naito.

[cero2k]