BRM Reviews the 10/5/2016 Lucha Underground (great)

[Big Red Machine]

DARIO’S DIAL OF DOOM- this week’s title shot goes to… PRINCE PUMA!

IVELISSE vs. MARIPOSA (w/Marty “The Moth” Martinez)- 3.75/10
Short match. Ivelisse wins, further spaying supposedly the greatest warrior of the Moth Tribe. Marty attacked Ivelisse after the match, and Mariposa joined him for a wacky-looking double-team move.

SEGMENT IN DARIO’S OFFICE- good
Dario’s is talking on the phone with someone. He assures this person that “yes, I know all about Prince Puma’s bloodline, but Matanza is a god. He will not be defeated tonight.” Hmmmm.
Then Johnny Mundo showed up and demanded a title shot yet again. Dario f*cked with him some more, and this resulted in Dario giving Jack Evans a shot at the Gift of the Gods Championship next week because Jack pinned Sexy Star in last week’s match.

FOLLOW THE WHITE RABBIT- Matrix reference. Also, “they’ll be here soon.” Like New Japan’s “Time Bomb,” and NXT’s “Sanity” I am just going to assume that this Minoru Suzuki until proven otherwise because everything is better with Minoru Suzuki in it.

BEST OF FIVE SERIES FOR “THE ULTIMATE OPPORTUNITY”: Cage(1) vs. El Texano Jr.(0)- 4.25/10
Cage wins in another short match.

IVELISSE’S NEW OBNOXIOUS BOYFRIEND IS SAMI CALIHAN JEREMIAH- this was a very good character-establishing segment.

LUCHA UNDERGROUND TITLE MATCH: “The Monster” Matanza Cueto(c) (w/Dario Cueto) vs. Prince Puma- 8/10
An awesome match despite the finish. If I were booking this, I would have just let it be a DQ so you have more of a reason to give Prince Puma another title shot once this Mil Muertes feud is over. Also, I hated it when a referee is forced to overlook something, essentially changing the rules in the middle of the match.

JOEY RYAN GIVES KILLSHOT AN EVELOPE- Joey got it from a dude outside who asked him to give it to Killshot. It turns out to be a burnt piece of paper that says “you left me for dead,” so I guess one of Killshot’s old squadmates is coming after him.


A great show from LU.

[cero2k]

SEGMENT IN DARIO’S OFFICE- good
Dario’s is talking on the phone with someone. He assures this person that “yes, I know all about Prince Puma’s bloodline, but Matanza is a god. He will not be defeated tonight.” Hmmmm.
Then Johnny Mundo showed up and demanded a title shot yet again. Dario f*cked with him some more, and this resulted in Dario giving Jack Evans a shot at the Gift of the Gods Championship next week because Jack pinned Sexy Star in last week’s match.
I'm really intrigued to see if Johnny will be pushed to do something drastic to finally get his title shot.

BEST OF FIVE SERIES FOR “THE ULTIMATE OPPORTUNITY”: Cage(1) vs. El Texano Jr.(0)- 4.25/10
Cage wins in another short match.
I liked this match a lot more than last week's

IVELISSE’S NEW OBNOXIOUS BOYFRIEND IS SAMI CALIHAN JEREMIAH- this was a very good character-establishing segment.
I feel a bit betrayed, I've always wanted Son of Havoc and Ivelisse to be a couple again

LUCHA UNDERGROUND TITLE MATCH: “The Monster” Matanza Cueto(c) (w/Dario Cueto) vs. Prince Puma- 8/10
An awesome match despite the finish. If I were booking this, I would have just let it be a DQ so you have more of a reason to give Prince Puma another title shot once this Mil Muertes feud is over. Also, I hated it when a referee is forced to overlook something, essentially changing the rules in the middle of the match.
Consider that all title matches have lineancy or relaxed rules when it comes to DQs, so it wasn't as bad IMO. I liked it this way with the DQ, hoping that next week they say something that Puma is out of the wheel and doesn't deserve anymore title shots, this should push Puma further down that dark path thing and lead to a Grave Consequences match with Muertes or something

[Big Red Machine]

SEGMENT IN DARIO’S OFFICE- good
Dario’s is talking on the phone with someone. He assures this person that “yes, I know all about Prince Puma’s bloodline, but Matanza is a god. He will not be defeated tonight.” Hmmmm.
Then Johnny Mundo showed up and demanded a title shot yet again. Dario f*cked with him some more, and this resulted in Dario giving Jack Evans a shot at the Gift of the Gods Championship next week because Jack pinned Sexy Star in last week’s match.
I'm really intrigued to see if Johnny will be pushed to do something drastic to finally get his title shot.
I'm that is where this is going. The question is not "if" Johnny will do something, but rather "when" he will do it and (perhaps even more importantly) "what" he will do.


IVELISSE’S NEW OBNOXIOUS BOYFRIEND IS SAMI CALIHAN JEREMIAH- this was a very good character-establishing segment.
I feel a bit betrayed, I've always wanted Son of Havoc and Ivelisse to be a couple again
I'm sure it will happen. They made Jeremiah out to be quite the douchebag.


LUCHA UNDERGROUND TITLE MATCH: “The Monster” Matanza Cueto(c) (w/Dario Cueto) vs. Prince Puma- 8/10
An awesome match despite the finish. If I were booking this, I would have just let it be a DQ so you have more of a reason to give Prince Puma another title shot once this Mil Muertes feud is over. Also, I hated it when a referee is forced to overlook something, essentially changing the rules in the middle of the match.
Consider that all title matches have lineancy or relaxed rules when it comes to DQs, so it wasn't as bad IMO. I liked it this way with the DQ, hoping that next week they say something that Puma is out of the wheel and doesn't deserve anymore title shots, this should push Puma further down that dark path thing and lead to a Grave Consequences match with Muertes or something
I hate the "we want 'real' winners and losers, therefore we will ignore the rules" in important matches" bullsh*t. It's yet another case of idiots copying what a good booker once said but not understanding the lengths he went to in order to make it work (in this case, the booker is Gabe, and the lengths he went to in order to make it work were to create a system of rules where count-outs were solely at the referee's discretion. I don't think I ever remember them just ignoring blatant cheating in ROH, and that's what this was. When he wanted sh*t like this to happen, he created the Relaxed Rules match to facilitate it.
Puma can still be removed from the wheel with the DQ win. Dario said the wheel is only for people who haven't had title shots at Matanza before, thus even with this DQ win, Puma would be have to be removed from it- and I think that would actually get more heat/do a better job at getting over the idea that Dario thinks Puma can beat Matanza than having him lose via interference and get pinned by Matanza does.
I agree with you about the final direction of this Puma vs. Muertes feud, though: Gravest Consequences.

[cero2k]

to answer both the Mundo and Puma thing.

if you leave it open that Puma deserves another title shot, it be really shitty if he never gets that title shot, and if he does, it be kinda shitty if he doesn't win since we know that so far, he is the only man to have Matanza's number on a one-on-one situation. The way they did it, we know that, but we also know that as much as he has his number, he can't get another title shot regardless of the wheel or if he deserves it or not, so there is an extra frustration for Puma that we can also feel, and that way, when we don't get that title shot and Matanza eventually loses the title to someone else, we don't feel robbed.

Now, it may be just me, but the biggest heel of the season is the World Underground to me, Mundo is being built to a huge heel-er turn, you're right, it's not an 'if', but a 'when' and 'what' situation. I had an if because i saw it hard to believe that he would out-heel Dario, especially if we were to have Dario cock-blocking Puma on a title shot, and considering he's already doing it with Rey Mysterio. They have mixed Mundo and Dario so much that whatever Mundo does, it has to be against Dario or Matanza, kinda like when Pentagon was about to break Dario's arm, but then we're gonna have sympathy on Dario while trying to cheer Mysterio/Puma against Dario. Shit's complicated man, I can't handle all these dilemmas and emotions

[Big Red Machine]

to answer both the Mundo and Puma thing.

if you leave it open that Puma deserves another title shot, it be really shitty if he never gets that title shot, and if he does, it be kinda shitty if he doesn't win since we know that so far, he is the only man to have Matanza's number on a one-on-one situation. The way they did it, we know that, but we also know that as much as he has his number, he can't get another title shot regardless of the wheel or if he deserves it or not, so there is an extra frustration for Puma that we can also feel, and that way, when we don't get that title shot and Matanza eventually loses the title to someone else, we don't feel robbed.

We don't "know" that Prince Puma definitely would have won. There is nothing wrong with having Puma win his feud with Mil then getting another shot against Matanza and losing clean. There is no reason to book finish like this if you're not intending on giving him another title shot. If you didn't want to give him another title shot, you would have Mil merely cause a distraction and have Matanza do all of the work of putting Puma away.

[cero2k]

to answer both the Mundo and Puma thing.

if you leave it open that Puma deserves another title shot, it be really shitty if he never gets that title shot, and if he does, it be kinda shitty if he doesn't win since we know that so far, he is the only man to have Matanza's number on a one-on-one situation. The way they did it, we know that, but we also know that as much as he has his number, he can't get another title shot regardless of the wheel or if he deserves it or not, so there is an extra frustration for Puma that we can also feel, and that way, when we don't get that title shot and Matanza eventually loses the title to someone else, we don't feel robbed.

We don't "know" that Prince Puma definitely would have won. There is nothing wrong with having Puma win his feud with Mil then getting another shot against Matanza and losing clean. There is no reason to book finish like this if you're not intending on giving him another title shot. If you didn't want to give him another title shot, you would have Mil merely cause a distraction and have Matanza do all of the work of putting Puma away.

of course they could do another title shot after the Mil feud, but they're racing against time, this is a non-kayfabe concern, i don't wanna get teased of a rematch if it doesn't come. But at the same time, if Matanza just does all the work, then I as a fan, i don't feel robbed from Puma winning and I don't want Puma to fight Muertes as much as I do right now, i feel so robbed that I wanna see Puma v Muertes more than Puma v Matanza II

[Big Red Machine]

to answer both the Mundo and Puma thing.

if you leave it open that Puma deserves another title shot, it be really shitty if he never gets that title shot, and if he does, it be kinda shitty if he doesn't win since we know that so far, he is the only man to have Matanza's number on a one-on-one situation. The way they did it, we know that, but we also know that as much as he has his number, he can't get another title shot regardless of the wheel or if he deserves it or not, so there is an extra frustration for Puma that we can also feel, and that way, when we don't get that title shot and Matanza eventually loses the title to someone else, we don't feel robbed.

We don't "know" that Prince Puma definitely would have won. There is nothing wrong with having Puma win his feud with Mil then getting another shot against Matanza and losing clean. There is no reason to book finish like this if you're not intending on giving him another title shot. If you didn't want to give him another title shot, you would have Mil merely cause a distraction and have Matanza do all of the work of putting Puma away.

of course they could do another title shot after the Mil feud, but they're racing against time, this is a non-kayfabe concern, i don't wanna get teased of a rematch if it doesn't come. But at the same time, if Matanza just does all the work, then I as a fan, i don't feel robbed from Puma winning and I don't want Puma to fight Muertes as much as I do right now, i feel so robbed that I wanna see Puma v Muertes more than Puma v Matanza II

That's my point: If they aren't going to do a Puma vs. Matanza rematch, then there is no reason to make you feel robbed of it. A distraction better focuses things on Puma vs. Muertes, which is where they are going. If you are going to do a rematch, the finish they did here is fine, but I think a DQ would have done a better jobbed of making us feel robbed of both.